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Technical Help > Question to the tapers

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TomLeMajorPosted at 2016-05-14 18:32:15(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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Hi all
For the best audience recording with Zoom H4n, what rec format choose ?
48 kHz/24 bits
96 kHz/16 bits
96 kHz/24 bits

Thanks for your answers.


http://www.whambam.fr
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SteveboyDonatedPosted at 2016-05-14 20:43:58(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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TomLeMajor wrote:

Hi allFor the best audience recording with Zoom H4n, what rec format choose ?48 kHz/24 bits96 kHz/16 bits96 kHz/24 bitsThanks for your answers.

I own a H2n and recently recorded 2 and a bit shows using an external mic. I recorded at 24/96 but some will say that 24/48 is best its individual choice I think. To burn to CD it has to be 16/44bit.

Steveboy


NO DISCUSSION I JUST WANT TO LISTEN TO THE MUSIC
WANTED
FRANKFURT 1976
1978 REHEARSALS
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zososhane69DonatedPosted at 2016-05-14 20:48:51(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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I concur with Steveboy. I use an Edirol but always prefer 24/96. You can always downsample the files from there.

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TomLeMajorPosted at 2016-05-15 10:51:13(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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OK. Thank you.


http://www.whambam.fr
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steve23yhPosted at 2016-05-15 10:55:05(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)
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I've got a Zoom H2 - haven't touched it from factory settings!  I guess 16/*44 and it seems to do the job nicely.


Don't blame me, I didn't do it!
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downunder2Posted at 2016-05-15 11:38:04(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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Edirol 24/96 do what you want after that.


steve

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toneblokePosted at 2016-05-15 12:58:10(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)
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I run two rigs: Roland R09HR and a Tascam Dr2d as backup, both with external power and mics, and ALWAYS record at 24/96.

When mastering your own captures you should use the best rate your machine can record. After this you can downsample (as stated above).


"Look up here, I’m in heaven
I’ve got scars that can’t be seen"
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hanoirocksPosted at 2016-05-15 17:39:54(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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I always record in 16/44 because;
I burn some to CD and who can be bothered with the dithering between sample rates?.
16/44 takes up less space
is easier on the batteries

There is no way I will ever be able to tell the difference from 24/96.

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toneblokePosted at 2016-05-16 03:34:52(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)
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hanoirocks wrote:

is easier on the batteries

That's fallacy. When I got my rigs I tested them to the shithouse - battery time being one thing.

All things being equal (fresh batteries) recording at 24/96 the batteries will last @ 5hr45min. At 16/44.1 they'll last 6hr05min. 15 odd minutes is something but not much.


Very few people can hear any difference between 24 and 16bit. The main reason you would record at a higher rate would be so that any manipulation done to the files is best done there because you have "more" to play with. If you did the same at 16bit results would be slightly less.

Last edited by tonebloke on 2016-05-16 03:35:20



"Look up here, I’m in heaven
I’ve got scars that can’t be seen"
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nogginPosted at 2016-05-16 09:54:57(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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24/96 & depending on seriousness, try to buy some decent external mics if you can at some stage.

Tapers Section site goes into all the details.

http://taperssection.com/

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joevigPosted at 2016-05-16 18:57:28(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)
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noggin wrote:

24/96 & depending on seriousness, try to buy some decent external mics if you can at some stage.Tapers Section site goes into all the details.http://taperssection.com/

One of the problems with the Zoom (I've got an H4) is that it's a bit obvious, even if you put gaffer  tape over the blinking LED.

I've been at gigs where I've set it to record and either popped it on the front of the stage or placed it in the pit behind the photographers, and it has caught the eye of a security goon.

(I recall an interesting conversation with one who told me I wasn't allowed to record because of copyright; I explained the difference between mechanical rights and performing rights and he seemed satisfied with that and left me alone).

A better set-up would be a "stealth rig", using a pair of external mics from Chris Church at Church Audio and a pre-amp/battery box. The mics are fixed to your spectacles or can be attached to a hat.

You won't be able to chat to your chums (but who talks at a gig anyway -- apart from the people in the row immediately in front of the taper!) but you'll have a lower profile, not to mention a better quality recording, than someone who has to plant their recorder before the set starts and has to go back to collect it after the show.


--
So who the fuck died and made you Grace Kelly?
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steve23yhPosted at 2016-05-16 21:35:30(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)
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I started recording gigs again in 2007, and haven't had even the merest brush with security.  In the UK they seem to have given up, since the moment the band comes on stage, all you can see is phones taking photos/video clips!

Of course, I avoid being obvious.  Usually put in breast pocket of shirt, so the LED is inside the pocket.  In an ideal world, I suppose I'd use external mics, but honestly haven't worked out where to get them (maybe I'll look in the tapers section!).

The one snag I have found with my Zoom, however, is that the mic gain slider moves if you so much as breathe heavily - so two or three times just after I got it, I found that by putting the gadget in my pocket, is moved to high gain, giving me an unusable recording.  That's where I now put the gaffer tape!  Low gain for small venues, medium for large.


Don't blame me, I didn't do it!
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SteveboyDonatedPosted at 2016-05-16 22:07:03(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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steve23yh wrote:

I started recording gigs again in 2007, and haven't had even the merest brush with security.  In the UK they seem to have given up, since the moment the band comes on stage, all you can see is phones taking photos/video clips!Of course, I avoid being obvious.  Usually put in breast pocket of shirt, so the LED is inside the pocket.  In an ideal world, I suppose I'd use external mics, but honestly haven't worked out where to get them (maybe I'll look in the tapers section!).The one snag I have found with my Zoom, however, is that the mic gain slider moves if you so much as breathe heavily - so two or three times just after I got it, I found that by putting the gadget in my pocket, is moved to high gain, giving me an unusable recording.  That's where I now put the gaffer tape!  Low gain for small venues, medium for large.

Steve - there is a lock button on the H2N which I believe worked on my last recording. I used an old Sony external Mic on my last recording in March it was a 709 ? with it poking out of a little pocket [for a mobile phone] in a work jacket, cut a hole in that pocket another cut in a side pocket for the lead and the H2N in the side pocket worked a treat no need for gaffa tape, started to record about 20 mins before the show was supposed to start add another 30 as the Diva was late on stage but came out really well.
As for security non-existent at the venue.

Steveboy


NO DISCUSSION I JUST WANT TO LISTEN TO THE MUSIC
WANTED
FRANKFURT 1976
1978 REHEARSALS
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TomLeMajorPosted at 2016-05-17 11:09:57(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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Thank you for all your answers.

I'm an old taper.
During 80's and 90's I used an Aiwa recorder walkman for audio
And Sony Betamax, Panasonic SVHS,  Sony 8mm, Sony HI8 professionals camescopes for video.
During 00's and 10's I used Sony MD and HIMD with Soundman Studio Rock external ears microphones (made in Bowie Berlin studio ;-) ) for audio.
And Sony DV and HDV professionals camescopes for vidéo.

I have "Some Fuckin' Lost Tapes" in my archives (but they are, not listed, in boxes into my barn).

Sunday, I realized my first H4n audience recording 24/96. Good job.

Could you tell me what are the essential steps (with audacity ?) in order to then broadcast here this record ?


http://www.whambam.fr
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gazatthebopPosted at 2016-05-18 07:26:46(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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I use a Tascam dr44 set at 48 kHz/24 bits. it records a show twice, one copy is 12db lower than the 1st (I think the zoom h6 has the same feature.) Always use new batteries and start the recording early is my advice.

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steve23yhPosted at 2016-05-18 09:34:17(467 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)
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Hear hear to new batteries.  Have run out two or three times now - once only two songs in!


Don't blame me, I didn't do it!
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100PCBPosted at 2016-05-19 17:37:23(466 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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Nothing is better than flipping tapes.  That required skill lol.

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SteveboyDonatedPosted at 2016-05-19 18:23:26(466 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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100PCB wrote:

Nothing is better than flipping tapes.  That required skill lol.

You could do it with one hand if I remember correctly!!!!!   You must have practiced in your sleep LOL

Steveboy


NO DISCUSSION I JUST WANT TO LISTEN TO THE MUSIC
WANTED
FRANKFURT 1976
1978 REHEARSALS
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joevigPosted at 2016-05-23 00:16:37(466 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)
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TomLeMajor wrote:

Could you tell me what are the essential steps (with audacity ?) in order to then broadcast here this record ?

It's a long time since I did any of this but, from memory, the steps I've taken with either Audacity or Audition is roughly:

  • Copy the wav onto the PC.
  • Make a copy of the wav and open it in the audio editor.
  • Find the start of the set and delete everything before.
  • Find the end of the set and delete everything after.
  • Apply a normalize filter.
  • Save the wav file.
  • If you want to distribute the recording, export it as a flac file.

    If you want to mark tracks, open the wav in an application like Goldwave to place the track markers.

    There may be some other things to think about too that I've forgotten to mention.

    There is lots of useful information in the Tapers Section forum: <http://taperssection.com>


    --
    So who the fuck died and made you Grace Kelly?
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    nogginPosted at 2016-05-23 02:58:27(466 wks ago) (Technical Help / Question to the tapers)


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    The flipping of the tape at the correct moment between songs was a definite skill, holding up the said brick of a recorder so the internal mic was above the crowd for the entire gig was another! Also, remembering to press both play & record was a basic yet essential skill which I forgot to do on some occasions! The bloody tape recorder would being playing & not recording! Some Bauhaus gigs ended up being half recorded by this error, whadyamean thats possibly a good thing! ;)

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